Why you’re not too late to Bitcoin

Andy interviews early Bitcoin investor Danny Oyekan, discussing his crypto journey, co-founding Blockfinex, and the growth of Bitcoin in emerging markets. They touch on financial literacy, building wealth, and the increasing appeal of alternative assets like Bitcoin and gold.

Why you’re not too late to Bitcoin 

Andy Pickering - Host

You're listening to Pod99, a podcast by Wealth99 that helps the 99% take control of their financial future. We talk to experts from across the alternative asset space, who share their insights on new wealth, how to build it, and how to keep it. Let's get on with the show. My guest today is Danny Oyekan. Danny is a self proclaimed Bitcoin maxi and he is also the CEO and co-founder of crypto investment firm Dan Holdings and crypto exchange Blockfinex. Welcome to the show, Danny. 

Danny Oyekan - Guest

Hi, Andy. It is nice to catch up with you today. 

Andy Pickering - Host

Good to catch up with you as well, Danny. Let's do what we do at the beginning of the show. I'll invite you to please introduce yourself and share some of your story because your story is fascinating, if I may say so. 

Danny Oyekan - Guest

Yeah, great. So I started in the bitcoin industry in 2012. In 2015 to 16, I doubled down on my Bitcoin investments and in 2018 I decided to do a lot of other stuff like venture investing in the crypto space and also outside the crypto space by around 2020. I then decided to start Blockfinex and launched that about a year and a half ago. 

Andy Pickering - Host

Very interesting. And well, I'd love to hear, Danny, your story as to what made you look at Bitcoin so early. I think you said 2012? That's early by any stretch. 

Danny Oyekan - Guest

A few things brought me into the industry. So I used to play a lot of online games at the time. I also was already in digital currency. So back then there were other centralized forms of digital currencies like Eagle Liberty Reserve and I was already involved with those. And then the third thing that happened was that there was a time when I needed to send money somewhere and Bitcoin was the only option at the time. So these three things were the initial things that brought me to Bitcoin. 

Andy Pickering - Host

Yeah. Fascinating. And so, in those early days, most of the people that were interested in Bitcoin were people like yourself, Danny, who, as you've explained, were interested in different forms of digital currency or needed to make cross-border payments in a more easy fashion than is able to be done with the banks and, of course, libertarians and people like that. But back in 2012, did you think that Bitcoin would go to the heights that it has and the global adoption that it has as fast as it has? 

Danny Oyekan - Guest

Well, maybe not as fast. But ten years is a long time. If you look at it from an adoption curve perspective, it's actually on par with what I thought about bitcoin. It's just that the way it happens is like it happens right in your face, and you don't really realize it's happening until you look back and it's like, ten years, it's gone. But I always felt that in the long run, with the emerging market thesis, when countries like Brazil, India, start to realize the power of Bitcoin and being their own banks and stuff like this, they will obviously adopt it because it's not controlled by anyone. It can’t be seized, it's just totally out of the banking system. 

But in terms of time frame, I've never been like a time frame guy. I just go with the halving cycles and also with the limited supply. Another main reason I always thought that in the long run, Bitcoin will obviously be a dominant player was that there was only ever going to be 21 million Bitcoin mined. So it's a no brainer. It's demand and supply. I'm a very big fan of the economics there. 

Andy Pickering - Host

Yeah, I mean, there's three certainties in life - Death, taxes, and 21 million Bitcoin. So you grew up in Nigeria, right? I'm curious, Danny, what is their interest in Bitcoin? Not just in Nigeria, but in Africa and these other emerging markets? 

Danny Oyekan - Guest

I grew up in a few countries, so I was in the US. I grew up a little bit in Nigeria for some time, and then I moved to the UAE about nine years ago. So my perspective of Africa is very simple. I think that the adoption curve is definitely there. Mostly when it comes to the real-world usage of crypto, it's mostly in Latin America and Africa because there's like, people actually using it for remittances, using it for payments. It's mostly used in cross-border remittances. So to send money from one country to the other, a lot of people send money from the US to Africa and vice versa. A few do in the middle east as well. Europe a lot. And this is what the main usage of Bitcoin specifically has been in Africa. But that's starting to change. 

You have a lot of people who trade crypto on a daily basis, not just bitcoin. But others are exposed to a lot of adoption in Africa at the moment. Maybe the volumes from Africa are a little bit lower compared to other markets, but in terms of the longevity and in the long run, you know that in the long run, the adoption is just going to continue growing. And as internet penetration grows in Africa, you're going to see that this is just going to go through the roof, especially in emerging markets like that. 

Andy Pickering - Host

Yeah, absolutely. And I know you said you spent time in Dubai as well. Do you still spend much time in Dubai at the moment? Because I've been interested to see that Dubai seems to be fast becoming another crypto hub, right? 

Danny Oyekan - Guest

Yeah, I've lived here for about nine years. I initially came here for Uni and I've lived here ever since. And for me Dubai is just so great. A lot of firms are moving out here. The space is moving very fast, very quickly, especially since Binance moved out here. And it's a very fascinating place to be. The government's backing all the crypto companies to push forward with their initiatives. The country really wants innovation and they're very pro innovation and pro policy and the regulatory clarity is there for whatever you want to do. So it makes it easier for people to set up here.

Andy Pickering - Host

Yeah, nice. Well, tell us a little bit about Blockfinex then. So this is a crypto exchange that you co-founded. I think you're the CEO, is that right? 

Danny Oyekan - Guest

Yeah, I'm the CEO of Blockfinex, which is a Binance powered exchange, which means that technology, custody and liquidity especially is all from Binance. So this allows us to offer about 600 cryptocurrencies, 2000 trading pairs and we have the most liquid order book in the world. We currently offer spot trading, no futures at the moment, this is coming in the near future. We are fast growing. Most of the users are spread around the world and we continue to push forward. 

Andy Pickering - Host

Yeah, nice. You said your users are around the world. Tell us about where those users are. What countries is Blockfinix available in? 

Danny Oyekan - Guest

So Blockfinix is available all around the world apart from the US. The biggest markets that we currently have are Japan and Brazil. But we're available in a lot of countries. And it's very fascinating to see the way people really come from all sorts of the world and understand the mission.

Andy Pickering - Host

Yes indeed. Well, thank you for that Danny. Also, be interested to hear a little bit about Dan Holdings. So this is kind of like an investment fund, I believe, so that's you as well?

Danny Oyekan - Guest

I'll explain a little bit more about Dan Holdings. So Dan holdings is a crypto web 3 ecosystem. So we have a decentralized social messenger we're working on and we have a decentralized social network we're working on. We also have some crypto payment processing businesses that we recently acquired. We recently acquired a company called Fluidcoins in Africa, which does crypto payment processing and that we're now taking to a lot of more markets around the world, which allows you to either accept crypto as a traditional business using the payment link and stuff like that. 

Andy Pickering - Host

And so do you want to just shout out those websites for both Blockfinix and Dan Holdings so people can take a look? 

Danny Oyekan - Guest

Yeah, Blockfinex is blockfinex.com. You can easily sign up for trade. You could buy your bitcoin with crypto with your credit card or debit card or through a P to P exchange partner. We're also partnered with MoonPay. And if you're in Brazil, you could use Pix. If you're in Europe, you could use Sepa. We have a lot of options to allow users on board on ramp onto the exchange. Yeah. And for Dan Holdings, the website is Dannyoekin.com. 

Andy Pickering - Host

Very nice. All right, well, let's bring it back to Bitcoin, Danny, because here at Wealth 99, we're really all about trying to empower the 99% of people out there who maybe aren't lucky enough to be part of the 1%, but they're part of the 99%, and we want to empower them to take control of their financial future. I guess you've been able to do that through Bitcoin and being early to Bitcoin. What are your views on Bitcoin today? I described you at the start of the show as a Bitcoin maximalist, but I'm not sure if that's actually true or not. So I'd love to just get a sense of where you see Bitcoin at the moment in terms of the context of the wider crypto ecosystem. 

Danny Oyekan - Guest

I'm certainly not a maxi, but I hold a lot of Bitcoin and the majority of my holdings are still Bitcoin. I tend to see the world in two ways, right? I see Bitcoin as a payment mechanism and payment infrastructure for the world. I see other cryptocurrencies as more of, like, utility for their own ecosystems and platforms that people can build on top of either layer one or layer two, blockchain or whatnot. Bitcoin is fighting its own battle. And it's winning because we just saw the banking crisis in the US. And saw what happened, and you can see that a lot of people are now understanding the reason why we need Bitcoin. 

It didn't dawn on a lot of people until that happened, that you actually need to self custody study your assets, because anything can happen at any time. 

Andy Pickering - Host

Yeah, that's very much the case. What do you say then to new people that are just starting because I'm sure you get this question all the time. What do you say to people who are just learning about Bitcoin now, and they can see the promise and potential of Bitcoin, but sometimes they might be discouraged because they think they've missed the boat, right? Because if you got into Bitcoin in 2012, great. That is good for you. But what about people that are maybe just turning 18 today or just learning about Bitcoin today in 2023? And they're looking at Bitcoin, and they're like, well, have I missed the boat? What do you say to those people? 

Danny Oyekan - Guest

I always tell people that you've never missed the boat. Just test it out. Buy $50, buy $10 of Bitcoin. Just check it out. You don't really need to go on an exchange. Buy Bitcoin, try to set up a wallet, a self custody wallet. Withdraw the funds from the exchange, maybe to a bitpay wallet or any wallet or ledger. You could even buy a ledger if you're buying more than that. But the main thing here is you have to learn how to custody your funds. Learn about seed phrases. Just try to understand what this is really about. 

I think that the most important thing to me is that this is how you get adoption of Bitcoin, is when people start to really understand what this is really about. This is about bringing power back to the people and not to certain governments or certain authorities or whatnot. It's about the people here, and it's the people's money. There was god's money, and there was the government's money, and now there's people's money. So you really need to understand that this is people's money. 

Andy Pickering - Host

I love that. Very well said, Danny. Bitcoin is the people's money. I could not have said it better. All right, well, let's go to a very quick break, and then we'll come back and we'll finish off, and we'll get Danny's insights into building new wealth. 

All right, we are back, and I'm with Danny Oyekan, CEO and co-founder of the Blockfinex exchange. And as we've learned, Danny was an early Bitcoin investor, and started getting his Bitcoin in 2012. Amazing stuff, Danny. We like to finish each podcast with just a quick discussion on wealth. 

My first question for you is, Danny, can you think of one piece of financial knowledge that should be taught at school just to empower our young people to help build their own financial future? 

Danny Oyekan - Guest

Financial literacy needs to be taught in schools where people learn how to save their money, spend their money diligently when they're growing up, and just have those ethics and ethos of saving wealth from a very young age. It really helps people in the long run, because when you get into the real world, this is what's really going to matter. So I think this is very important. And also, I think blockchain should really be taught in schools. The blockchain technology itself needs to be taught more in schools so people understand what the technology is really about. 

Andy Pickering - Host

I like it. Thank you, Danny. All right, well, what would you say is your most contrarian view on building wealth? 

Danny Oyekan - Guest

Well, my most contrarian view will be that I think that it's a gradual process, it doesn't happen overnight. But you need to really understand that you're building for 5, 10, 15, 20 years down the line. You're not building for today, and this amount of time can come before you know it. So you need to really look at what your priorities are, have a plan, and build according to that plan. This is my personal view on building wealth. It happens over time. And remember the market always rewards the patient and not the non-patient. 

Andy Pickering - Host

Yes, indeed. I like it. The market rewards the patient. You have to have time in the market. Think for the long term. All right, next question. Danny, in 30 seconds or less, what is the bull case for Bitcoin? 

Danny Oyekan - Guest

The bull Case for Bitcoin is here. We have a perfect storm. Right? It's not so nice to say, but I think that the bull case for Bitcoin is finally here. And we didn't think it was going to happen this fast, but you have a banking crisis, you have geopolitical situation that's becoming a mess, and you have China setting up the yuan to start new trade routes and trade currencies. I think that it's certainly the time for the bull case for Bitcoin where mass adoption is going to come in because everyone's just going to realize that you have to self custody. And as long as people get the message, I think we're fine. 

Andy Pickering - Host

I like it. Thank you, Danny. All right, well, same thing. 30 seconds or less. Gold. What is the bull case for gold in 30 seconds? 

Danny Oyekan - Guest

For gold? The bull case for gold is pretty similar. I'm personally of the view that bitcoin and gold need to start trading against each other. And in the digital form, I think that gold is also a store of value. And I think that bitcoin and gold can coexist. Right. I personally think that the fiat Ponzi scheme is dead at this moment. And the only two assets that you should have most of your wealth in, either bitcoin or gold. If you feel that bitcoin is too risky, well Gold has been there for 1000 years, so you know for sure that this is secure. Bitcoin is number one. Gold is there as well. 

Andy Pickering - Host

Well said, Danny. And obviously here at Wealth 99, we agree with you. So we make it possible for investors to access all sorts of alternative assets. So that means crypto assets such as Bitcoin, Ethereum, and many of the other leading blue chip crypto assets, but also precious metals, in the form of tokenized precious metals. So we've got gold, silver, and platinum available in tokenized form. Do you think that there is a market for tokenized precious metals? Is that the future of precious metals investing? Is that something you would consider at Blockfinix? 

Danny Oyekan - Guest

Yes, definitely. I'm a big proponent of bitcoin and gold. And I think tokenized forms of them will coexist with bitcoin and become various forms of money. So you have Bitcoin, gold, silver, and this becomes people's money. 

Andy Pickering - Host

Yeah, the people's money. And of course, obviously, Danny, it's another way forward because buying physical gold and silver can be a bit of a pain, but being able to buy tokenized gold and silver, just makes that access to the asset that much easier. And of course, it makes it more liquid because it can be much more easily sold. So it just makes sense for the future, I reckon. Tokenized precious metals, let's bring it on. 

Danny Oyekan - Guest

Yes, I totally agree. I think that even bringing tokenized precious metals and gold specifically into payments, into global payments, is going to be a thing, especially with the current macroeconomic environment. People don't trust the dollar anymore. So it's actually the perfect storm happening where bitcoin and gold can become those two currencies that are not related to any government or any power or any major nuclear power or whatnot. And you can store those. If you have a tokenized version of gold or you have bitcoin, you can have that in your digital wallet, either in your phone or on a ledger. 

Andy Pickering - Host

Fantastic. Well. Very well said, Danny. Thank you very much for coming on the show.

Danny Oyekan - Guest

Great. Thanks for having me. 

Andy Pickering - Host

That was Danny from Blockfinex. Always good to get different people's perspectives on their Bitcoin journey. And that was a very interesting one from Danny who started acquiring his Bitcoin in 2012, but as he said, it's still not too late if you're just getting into Bitcoin in 2023. It does seem to be a very interesting setup at the moment as Danny was talking about, with a potential banking crisis in the US. Which is just making alternative assets that much more attractive and that much more effective in a diversified investment portfolio. And really, that's all we're trying to do here at Wealth 99, give you access to those assets. Simple as that. All right, well, thank you very much for listening. 

https://www.blockfinex.com/